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NFTs + Rum?


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Andy avatar image
Andy (PREMIUM) 🇬🇧 | 122 ratings Author Posted 7 Dec '21

I know this isn't a typical RR discussion, but I've been learning a little more about NFTs recently, and specifically how it allows for fractional ownership. The whole https://www.constitutiondao.com/ specifically peaked my interest. Some platforms like https://fractional.art/ even facilitate the process. Any chance a few rum folks are also in the NFT/shared ownership space?

Just thinking out loud, I've always throught it might be fun to as a group buy an extremely rare rum or a cask (or multiple?). But the admin load seemed quite high. I wonder if using an NFT might make the process easier and also more liquid by listing it on something like https://opensea.io/? Possibly involving a broker like https://www.rum.nl/ to source/store would be helpful as well.

kudzey avatar image
kudzey (PREMIUM) 🇵🇱 | 38 ratings Replied 7 Dec '21

Just had a conversation about it yesterday! Wow!

Unfortunately, I find no use of NFT for rums. Even though some are highly collectible, rum is meant to be drunk at some point. Once spread between multiple owners, the chance of the bottle ever being opened decrease significantly. 

Andy avatar image
Andy (PREMIUM) 🇬🇧 | 122 ratings Author Replied 7 Dec '21

I guess in theory with a decentralized autonomous organization (DAO) the group could decide whether to hold the bottle/cask for investment purposes or drink the contents at some point? My first thought was for it to start as more of an investment vehicle, but it would also sure be cool to get a mini bottle of some excellent expensive rum as well that we'd never buy on our own.

kudzey avatar image
kudzey (PREMIUM) 🇵🇱 | 38 ratings Replied 7 Dec '21

I've also been thinking about buying an expensive bottle in a group of 20-40 people and sharing samples, that would make it much more accessible. I would really prefer to have 70 different 1cl samples than a 70 cl of one legendary rum. 

It would be pretty cool if the bottlers just issue samples directly to the market.

Rene Rum avatar image
Rene Rum (PREMIUM) 🇨🇭 | 509 ratings Replied 7 Dec '21

The idea of buying our own barrel has been in the minds of our rum gang for a few years. I also think that it is much easier to make such a purchase with your buddies. Or with a simple crowdfunding then you remain the master. 

But yes, new technologies are always interesting and worth trying, although the points of contact between digital and analog are not always easy (NFTs and rum). Well, tasting a rare and precious rum is always tempting.

A broker is certainly not a bad choice, years ago 1423 from Denmark had bulk rum on offer, these barrels may now have been bottled for a few rock bands :-)

Rene Rum avatar image
Rene Rum (PREMIUM) 🇨🇭 | 509 ratings Replied 7 Dec '21

@kudzey

Samples are always a good thing to taste expensive rum. Or also the visit of a fair. I prefer samples, so I can calmly deal with the rum. Most of my tasted rum in the expensive range were samples.

Fortunately, some stores here in Switzerland offer samples, I prefer then 4cl .

Andy avatar image
Andy (PREMIUM) 🇬🇧 | 122 ratings Author Replied 7 Dec '21

Through the Tasting Club we have the ability to convert bottles to mini bottles in a professional way - so that could be an option.

It would probably be an easier way to get something up and running with a single bottle purchase that was pre-agreed to split into mini bottles. Then maybe in the future move on to barrels and holding/investment.

If anyone has a suggestion for a bottle to buy we could discuss options here. 

Something to consider is there will be a fee involved with creating the mini bottles and shipping. In theory it might be better cost wise to bid on a number of rare bottles and send out a number of mini bottles at the same time. Our TC boxes take a maximum of 6 at a time.

kudzey avatar image
kudzey (PREMIUM) 🇵🇱 | 38 ratings Replied 8 Dec '21

I would grab a sample of Velier's Demerara or Caroni with no hesitation. I will probably never but the full bottle of these. Any SWR (except the El Dorado) is also interesting for me.

Paul B avatar image
Paul B 🇺🇸 | 452 ratings Replied 16 Dec '21

NFT's are basically one-of-a-kind digital art that originated with celebreties. Each time it exchanges hands through the block chain, it supposedly increases in value. As an example, Melania Trump is the latest to jump in on this. I would never fall for such a thing.

From what I have seen on celebrity booze and wine, most of them go nowhere in value. For rum, there is Ron de Jeremy (the notorious adult film star) and Motorhead. For whiskey, Bob Dylan now has his own line of them called Heaven's Door. In all cases, fools and their money will soon part.

Sharing a cask among several buyers would be good for those in Europe, but where I live, I cannot even have one drop shipped into my state.

Captain Lee avatar image
Captain Lee 🇺🇸 | 25 ratings Replied 17 Dec '21

Check out this story: https://therumlab.com/samai-distillery-launches-the-nft-project-founders-reserve-samai-rum-oak-barrels/

Basically, the distillery sells you a NFT that gives you ownership of a barrel in their warehouse.  Presumably at some point, for an added fee, they would bottle it for you.  I could easily see this becoming popular amongst rum clubs, high end spirits stores, etc. that are already buying casks to have a unique bottle to sell.

Paul B avatar image
Paul B 🇺🇸 | 452 ratings Replied 17 Dec '21

Captain Lee:

That is an interesting and detailed article about NFT's branching out from unique digital art and getting into unique rums. However, I wonder why the two founders had to move from Venezuela to Cambodia.  I certainly would never fall for their game.

dae avatar image
dae 🇲🇴 | 0 ratings Replied 10 Feb '22

hey guys, just a disclaimer I'm a FT crypto investor/trader, and I've participated in a few DAOs.

Nice to see this idea mentioned here! This is certainly something very doable and I've been dreaming of something like this happening for a while.

We'd require to have 2 separate DAOs, one directly for consumption, but another one with a more long term thinking (specially for casks). We'd stipulate right away in the beginning that we'd output a bottle for each on the 10th year, another for the 15th, with a sample each time etc, everything set in a smart contract. Of course we could always change the rules up, that's the flexibility a DAO gives, anyone can issue a proposal and we'd go for votes.

NFTs are not just for digital art, but as a proof of any ownership. For bottles you can even embed them with NFC chips to attach to it to the NFTs etc.

I agree that we'd need a 3rd party custodian for this, with insurance too.

There are countless open source DAO platforms, so although there'd be costs involved for the platform deployment, it really won't be super costly.

For sure we'd have to keep a treasury fund for maintenance , so maybe we could take a fee for each transaction, every time someone sells their NFT, the DAO would take a cut of that (like 1% or something).

I'm really just brainstorming and throwing ideas out now, don't crucify me if you think something is silly.

 

Andy avatar image
Andy (PREMIUM) 🇬🇧 | 122 ratings Author Replied 14 Feb '22

Those all seem like great ideas! The 'challenge' so far is none of us really seems to know what the first few steps to get something like this going... maybe you do?

I especially liked the part where you mentioned creating some samples/bottles at certain ages - eg 10,15, 20 yrs, etc. then I guess the DAO could alter through some kind of voting process?

OdysseusUnbound avatar image
OdysseusUnbound 🇨🇦 | 40 ratings Replied 15 Feb '22

I'm admittedly ignorant here, but why is a NFT necessary if a bunch of friends want to invest in a cask or three? I've been part of a group that purchased 3 casks of whisky from a distillery here in Ontario, Canada. The distillery made and aged each whisky to our specs and we decided when to bottle them. What does a NFT add to this whole experience? Is it for people who never plan on actually owning/drinking the product? I'm not judging, just curious about how this works.

Rene Rum avatar image
Rene Rum (PREMIUM) 🇨🇭 | 509 ratings Replied 15 Feb '22

Hi guys,

I thought NFT's were about ownership verification at the beginning too, then I came across this.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XwMjPWOailQ

Just as an info. I also don't know if it is the same thing.

Paul B avatar image
Paul B 🇺🇸 | 452 ratings Replied 15 Feb '22

Rene:

That is a fantastic video!!!! Fools and their money always part.

dae avatar image
dae 🇲🇴 | 0 ratings Replied 15 Feb '22

@Andy

yes the whole point of a Dao is that we can have pre-set rules in the beginning, but anyone can participate with a new proposal, it really depends how flexible we want to run the DAO, setting some ground-limit rules will help, otherwise we'd just be issuing bottles every month and that just doesn't seem to be realistic logistically

@OdysseusUnbound 

you are right, a bunch of friends don't need any of this tech complexity, as you have inner trust cuz of your relation, but if you were to scale this (involving a few dozen people), through this DAO mechanism, you wouldn't need to trust me (with 0 ratings on this community) or any other members participating

There are several mechanisms to avoid malice, for example, if we were to raise funds first and afterwards vote on a cask to purchase, we'd first raise funds, but prior to that we'd have voted for a treasury management committee. With multi-sig, we could for eg assign 5 reputable members of this community (not me obviously as I have 0 ratings and not a long reputable participation here) and every time we were to make a purchase (ie. release funds) we'd need at least 4 of their signatures on their transaction)

@Rene Rum

interesting video, and it's a very logical and realistic take. What an NFT is, is really a "digital contract", and certainly not every country will accept it as a legal binding contract between parties. Something for sure we could try to get verification in Scotland or in the UK? (any lawyers here?)

That's why in the 1st post I suggested right away that we'd require a 3rd party reputable custodian (which provides cask custody and could hold for us insurance on the cask, or for any other legal matter), to make this bureaucratically more viable

 

dae avatar image
dae 🇲🇴 | 0 ratings Replied 15 Feb '22

@Andy

Although I have experience participating in a DAO, I don't have experience deployment one per se. There's quiet a few options out there, listing a couple so you can have an idea:

https://aragon.org/

https://daostack.io/

 

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